I don’t know why you keep acting like I’m against voting when that’s all I’ve been supporting this whole thread. I do take the time out of my day to vote, even helping my elderly father who struggles walking get to the polls. I constantly advocate for more people to vote and convince my friends and coworkers to do the same. It’s just that the bubble I fill in (we only have paper tickets here no electric machines I hear other places got) doesn’t have a D or R next to it. The people I talk to are tired of the inaction Dems have shown for decades with many only voting for Conservatives cause they get tricked. I’ve gotten many who voted Trump in 2016 and 2020 to vote for actual progressives in 2024. We always talk about needing to build an actual progressive party and, as anyone will tell you, that starts by actually supporting them at every chance and takes a lot of time to achieve. Over 40k people supported a movement away from the major parties and no Harris would not have won the state had they all voted for her instead (she’d still be over 500k votes short and that’s with 70% of registered voters voting which is pretty close to the 75% figure I see many wish would vote). She’d need basically half of the remaining people to vote for her and I just don’t see a world in that happening after spending time with non-voters.
I don’t know why you keep acting like I’m against voting when that’s all I’ve been supporting this whole thread.
Against voting for harm reduction. IE, anything that might actually make a difference in the lives of millions.
We always talk about needing to build an actual progressive party and, as anyone will tell you, that starts by actually supporting them at every chance and takes a lot of time to achieve.
Yeah, and voting for a third party presidential candidate when the two major parties have been consistently polling at near 50% for the month before the election? Maybe not so fucking helpful.
I mean, very helpful to those who want to see more genocide and oppression of minorities, I guess. But that’s usually not a goal of leftists.
But hey, who cares about the thousands of dead Iranians? Not your problem, right? You have your moral purity to uphold.
I’m not going to pretend that’s a course of (in)action worthy of anything but utter disgust, same as someone who says that the way to win WW2 is to help the Nazis genocide the untermensch. I’m sure as shit not going to asspat you for it. We may be able to work together as-needed in other areas, but I’m never going to pretend that that’s anything but abhorrent.
We’d still be seeing genocide. Harris was very open about viewing Iran as a massive enemy and refusing to put any stops to giving Israel weapons. She publicly stated she wanted our military to get stronger when talking about Iran and had no problems with Biden going around Congress to support Israel.
But that’s all fine cause at least then it’s just be overseas and nothing happening at home (ignore that Biden gave massive funding to ICE also and encouraged police to deal with college protestors)
In Israel, yes. That was never a fucking choice we had, considering that some 75% of this fucking country still thinks Israel is our friends-to-the-end ally.
That’s what ‘harm reduction’ means. It doesn’t mean “I’m doing this because it will lead to socialism and a good outcome.” It means “Our policies currently don’t get anywhere near enough support for our candidate to win, and there are only two realistic outcomes; we should cast our vote, one act which costs ~20-30 minutes of our time, with the realistic option that gives us the LESS fucked result which results in LESS harm and more room for us to fucking WORK AND ORGANIZE so that we can get a fucking time when two fuckwits aren’t our only options - whether by the ballot or the bullet.”
But that’s all fine cause at least then it’s just be overseas and nothing happening at home (ignore that Biden gave massive funding to ICE also and encouraged police to deal with college protestors)
“Harris would have totally invaded Iran and tanked her own approval numbers!”
I see you’re a very stable genius, just like the current president.
Look ya’ll seem to love the % Hitler things so I’ll put it like this. The choices you see are 100% Hitler and 99.99999% Hitler, but ignore the several 0% Hitlers also standing there wanting votes and have plans on how not to be Hitler then get upset when people support 0% Hitler over 99.99999999% Hitler. Like I said, I view harm reduction as being 0 harm which means supporting 0% Hitler.
Considering the third party candidates available in the USA, there were no “0% Hitler” candidates, unless you only view some genocides as worth opposing.
I’m not upset that people support “0% Hitler”; I’m upset that people act like solipsistic morons when voting. If more people actually supported “0% Hitler” and they had a chance to win, this wouldn’t be a problem.
So how do you get more people to support 0% Hitler if you constantly publicly yell at the people who do?
“Don’t waste your vote on a candidate who is still polling under 1% in a race where there is a grotesquely worse candidate and a less-bad candidate both at near 50%” isn’t telling you “Don’t support 0% Hitler”, it’s telling you "Work on building support for 0% Hitler before you try to enter an election that requires a fucking plurality of the nation’s population to agree with your choice."
And and yes there was a 0% Hitler choice in the race
I’m sorry that you don’t think Ukrainians and Uyghurs are human beings, but unsurprising given your positions thus far.
I don’t know why you keep acting like I’m against voting when that’s all I’ve been supporting this whole thread. I do take the time out of my day to vote, even helping my elderly father who struggles walking get to the polls. I constantly advocate for more people to vote and convince my friends and coworkers to do the same. It’s just that the bubble I fill in (we only have paper tickets here no electric machines I hear other places got) doesn’t have a D or R next to it. The people I talk to are tired of the inaction Dems have shown for decades with many only voting for Conservatives cause they get tricked. I’ve gotten many who voted Trump in 2016 and 2020 to vote for actual progressives in 2024. We always talk about needing to build an actual progressive party and, as anyone will tell you, that starts by actually supporting them at every chance and takes a lot of time to achieve. Over 40k people supported a movement away from the major parties and no Harris would not have won the state had they all voted for her instead (she’d still be over 500k votes short and that’s with 70% of registered voters voting which is pretty close to the 75% figure I see many wish would vote). She’d need basically half of the remaining people to vote for her and I just don’t see a world in that happening after spending time with non-voters.
Against voting for harm reduction. IE, anything that might actually make a difference in the lives of millions.
Yeah, and voting for a third party presidential candidate when the two major parties have been consistently polling at near 50% for the month before the election? Maybe not so fucking helpful.
I mean, very helpful to those who want to see more genocide and oppression of minorities, I guess. But that’s usually not a goal of leftists.
But hey, who cares about the thousands of dead Iranians? Not your problem, right? You have your moral purity to uphold.
We’d still be seeing genocide. Harris was very open about viewing Iran as a massive enemy and refusing to put any stops to giving Israel weapons. She publicly stated she wanted our military to get stronger when talking about Iran and had no problems with Biden going around Congress to support Israel.
But that’s all fine cause at least then it’s just be overseas and nothing happening at home (ignore that Biden gave massive funding to ICE also and encouraged police to deal with college protestors)
In Israel, yes. That was never a fucking choice we had, considering that some 75% of this fucking country still thinks Israel is our friends-to-the-end ally.
That’s what ‘harm reduction’ means. It doesn’t mean “I’m doing this because it will lead to socialism and a good outcome.” It means “Our policies currently don’t get anywhere near enough support for our candidate to win, and there are only two realistic outcomes; we should cast our vote, one act which costs ~20-30 minutes of our time, with the realistic option that gives us the LESS fucked result which results in LESS harm and more room for us to fucking WORK AND ORGANIZE so that we can get a fucking time when two fuckwits aren’t our only options - whether by the ballot or the bullet.”
“Harris would have totally invaded Iran and tanked her own approval numbers!”
I see you’re a very stable genius, just like the current president.
Look ya’ll seem to love the % Hitler things so I’ll put it like this. The choices you see are 100% Hitler and 99.99999% Hitler, but ignore the several 0% Hitlers also standing there wanting votes and have plans on how not to be Hitler then get upset when people support 0% Hitler over 99.99999999% Hitler. Like I said, I view harm reduction as being 0 harm which means supporting 0% Hitler.
Considering the third party candidates available in the USA, there were no “0% Hitler” candidates, unless you only view some genocides as worth opposing.
I’m not upset that people support “0% Hitler”; I’m upset that people act like solipsistic morons when voting. If more people actually supported “0% Hitler” and they had a chance to win, this wouldn’t be a problem.
So how do you get more people to support 0% Hitler if you constantly publicly yell at the people who do?
And and yes there was a 0% Hitler choice in the race
“Don’t waste your vote on a candidate who is still polling under 1% in a race where there is a grotesquely worse candidate and a less-bad candidate both at near 50%” isn’t telling you “Don’t support 0% Hitler”, it’s telling you "Work on building support for 0% Hitler before you try to enter an election that requires a fucking plurality of the nation’s population to agree with your choice."
I’m sorry that you don’t think Ukrainians and Uyghurs are human beings, but unsurprising given your positions thus far.
Considering Biden armed and supported Israel WAY more than Ukraine I wouldn’t say he or Harris view them as people either.
The only true way for people to see mass support for a good candidate is voting for them in the general. Bad choices don’t deserve a single vote.