I don’t know the story of Cassandra, but I took the boy who cried wolf to mean “one shouldn’t lie, specifically because it’s easy to keep doing it, and there will be consequences for you personally if you do lie”.
So I read again and saw “women only” in the first rule which before I just read that to mean women’s topics only. Does that mean men aren’t allowed to comment? I didn’t realize that was the case if so.
Ah yes, that does mean that men aren’t allowed to comment here. Very happy to chat about Cassandra or feminism or the patriarchy in another community anytime though! !feminism@lemmy.world is rather active :)
I think it’s opposite sides… One is telling lies and being believed until not, so that’s you, don’t tell lies or you won’t be believed eventually. The other is telling the truth and not being believed, so don’t dismiss another person’s story unless you know it to be untrue just because everyone else doesn’t believe them. I think they’re both good lessons.
Cassandra was cursed by Apollo because she refused him sex.
I can see a situation where a priest or a camp counselor or an uncle tries to rape a kid, and the kids thinks “well if I try to stop it, I’ll just get in trouble like Cassandra”. And then later when they think about reporting the rape, they think “nobody will believe me, like Cassandra”.
Cynicism helps people survive in a cruel society, but it also makes society crueler. I’m glad that our modern society is a little bit better than the Hellenes. I don’t want it to get more like that society.
The way past cynical detachment is with material change, not pretense and deception.
Children may well have parents or an environment where reporting rape gets them in trouble. At least a cynical child may recognize an adult being angry at them for reporting a rape as an enemy who can hopefully be circumvented. A naive child would be blindsided and could probably be cowed into silence.
So tell them the story of Cassandra, tell them how it can really happen, and then tell them in what way they live in a society that is different from back then.
Tell them about the impulse to stay quiet and not make a fuss. Tell them about the impulse to shut down inconveniences, about gatekeepers and victim blamers and perpetrator apologists. Tell them about transformative justice, about police violence, about child protective services and its abuses. And maybe make a plan with them to find their own justice if shit were to hit the fan and the parents are unavailable/unreliable.
If it’s any consolation, none of this will be nearly as daunting as them realizing they were born into a dying world and the people in charge are actively trying to make things worse.
Because the story of Cassandra doesn’t help kids get wiser, it just helps them get more cynical
Yeah. This post sounds good, but the actual moral of the story sucks.
One is “don’t lie all the time or nobody will believe you, even when telling the truth.”
The other is “nobody will ever believe you, regardless of how truthful you are.”
Is that the moral… I remember one who would say that it is
Never tell the same lie twice.
Unless it’s for consistency. If you have a long-term lie going, you need to keep it consistent, or others will notice the plot-holes.
Plain and simple
I’m not sure this moral sucks though.
The other one sucks, but it’s true.
We agree. I’m saying that one is good, and the other sucks.
<3
I don’t know the story of Cassandra, but I took the boy who cried wolf to mean “one shouldn’t lie, specifically because it’s easy to keep doing it, and there will be consequences for you personally if you do lie”.
Hey TrickDacy, thanks for stopping by - have you had a chance to read the rules for this community?
I think I have before, and I just read them again to be sure. Did I do something wrong?
Nope, just checking, you’re good if you’ve seen them! I’ve seen you around before quite a bit, but not a familiar “face” to me here.
So I read again and saw “women only” in the first rule which before I just read that to mean women’s topics only. Does that mean men aren’t allowed to comment? I didn’t realize that was the case if so.
Ah yes, that does mean that men aren’t allowed to comment here. Very happy to chat about Cassandra or feminism or the patriarchy in another community anytime though! !feminism@lemmy.world is rather active :)
I just edited in quotes in my comment in case it wasn’t clear before.
I think it’s opposite sides… One is telling lies and being believed until not, so that’s you, don’t tell lies or you won’t be believed eventually. The other is telling the truth and not being believed, so don’t dismiss another person’s story unless you know it to be untrue just because everyone else doesn’t believe them. I think they’re both good lessons.
So it helps them get wiser, just not in a way that makes them compliant.
Cassandra was cursed by Apollo because she refused him sex.
I can see a situation where a priest or a camp counselor or an uncle tries to rape a kid, and the kids thinks “well if I try to stop it, I’ll just get in trouble like Cassandra”. And then later when they think about reporting the rape, they think “nobody will believe me, like Cassandra”.
Cynicism helps people survive in a cruel society, but it also makes society crueler. I’m glad that our modern society is a little bit better than the Hellenes. I don’t want it to get more like that society.
The way past cynical detachment is with material change, not pretense and deception.
Children may well have parents or an environment where reporting rape gets them in trouble. At least a cynical child may recognize an adult being angry at them for reporting a rape as an enemy who can hopefully be circumvented. A naive child would be blindsided and could probably be cowed into silence.
So tell them the story of Cassandra, tell them how it can really happen, and then tell them in what way they live in a society that is different from back then.
Tell them about the impulse to stay quiet and not make a fuss. Tell them about the impulse to shut down inconveniences, about gatekeepers and victim blamers and perpetrator apologists. Tell them about transformative justice, about police violence, about child protective services and its abuses. And maybe make a plan with them to find their own justice if shit were to hit the fan and the parents are unavailable/unreliable.
If it’s any consolation, none of this will be nearly as daunting as them realizing they were born into a dying world and the people in charge are actively trying to make things worse.
There’s nothing wrong with that. Being cynical can prevent you from being vulnerable.
I’d rather we were taught stories like that than stories like this or… worse.