Bigger deal is withdrawing from NATO. Fearmongering of extreme right, is on their anti-NATO platforms. The center right (CDU in Germany) leads the same “practical” anti-immigrant views just with pure US energy/global destruction subservience.
Melenchon seems like a good shot. I don’t remember a good French president in my entire life. They all were pretty forgettable and sorry.
He’s just anti-west not anti-genocide unfortunately. Wholesale supports letting Putin kill more Ukrainians.
ETA: A Russian military plane landed in Israel. If that’s a sign of things to come and Russia and Israel start cooperating, you bet Melenchon will weaken his rhetoric on Palestine.
escort citizen flottilas
That’s a very weird choice in a scenario where you have a state at your hand that can escort it’s own aid shipments at much higher scale.
This smells like he wants to weasel out, pointing at some irrelevant nominal change that Israel did which flipped the conditional “if necessary” false or something like that
I guess it’s a political way to say France will use its military to deliver aid to Gaza militarily without saying he will pay for it.
In hindsight this might look weaksauce but for now I’ll take it. I’m willing to give some leeway to people pushing the overton window until it is pushed.
Yeah. He said he was willing to point guns at the entity.
That’s the kind of incrementalism I can get behind.
You’re right I flipped. I doubted if he was willing to do that but OP swayed me.
Melenchon is not saying “I’ll help Gaza” (my argument was that he could’ve done so in easier ways if he really wanted to)
…but “I protect my citizens even if they want to help Gaza”. Weaker morally, but doesn’t come across as an evil trick anymore (but as a good trick)
without saying he will pay for [the aid]
If it’s about political expediency of signalling cost aversion is aid the big cost factor?
I would assume the expensive part of escorting aid is the cost of the military deployment, no?
I get your point about the Overton window, but I also see a flipside to it: the risk is sheepdogging revolutionary sentiment into the liberal electoral system.
The overton window becomes a carve out in the liberal accepted framework (even though it stays inconsequential in terms of action) which could be a way of releasing tension in the rebellious climate of french politics right now
If it’s about political expediency of signalling cost aversion is aid the big cost factor?
One is about enforcing the safety of French people doing what they want. The other is about a more offensive stance. This is much easier to sell
The overton window becomes a carve out in the liberal accepted framework (even though it stays inconsequential in terms of action) which could be a way of releasing tension in the rebellious climate of french politics right now
I think it’s possible to keep moving the overton window. We see more and more people who joined meekly now supporting the Palestinian resistance. The question is whether those who initially moved the window will move along with it, or remain their Zionist position e.g. Norman Finkelstein.
One is about enforcing the safety of French people doing what they want. The other is about a more offensive stance. This is much easier to sell
You’re absolutely right — Fair point. The perspective of “diplomacy” does change things — I hadn’t thought of that.
Signals less Palestinian Solidarity and more nationalism, then though. But still a net helpful notion I agree. Albeit it weaker than “I’ll bring food to Gaza and aim at Israelis if I have to.”
Feels like a little late to the party to me.
I believe he’s a socdem type, but it’s great to see that the people of France have shown such resistance and organization that the socdems are willing to take positions like this publicly in order to retain popularity
Holy shit had a dream the other day that France was the first EU country to militarily support resistance to Israel’s genocide and I don’t even know shit about EU politics. Weird!
Wonder if Spain would join them in escorting the flotilla?
It pretty much has to be France, or maybe the UK. Only a nuclear power can stand up to another nuclear power.
I think any NATO member could choose to do the same. It’s Israel that has everything to lose.
zionists have too much of a stranglehold on British politics for that ever to happen.
What would be better is that countries come together to refuse to economically trade with them, eventually resulting in a blockade so no goods can get to them, forcing them to fold as South Africa did.
deleted by creator
How do French people feel about him?
IIRC pretty divided, but he is an old darling of the left. He is looked at romantically.
Do it!
He won’t. The guy is a populist millionaire and at best he’ll do some token actions for publicity with zero effect and at worst he’ll fuck up so hard that he’ll have to do a 180 (like Mitterand).
His priority is literaly to pass a law for citizens to be able to vote to take the president and other elected officials out of office.
And also fully withdraw France from NATO. Even DeGaulle didn’t have the gall to do something that stupid.
You’re probably right
This guy’s gonna be targeted for sure, I hope he doesn’t get bopped
First the media is going to smear him, then they will try to go after him legally, then he will be shouted at and ganged up on in the European Council, and if none of that works, France will be attacked financially and the ECB will let it happen.
and if none of that works, France will be attacked financially and the ECB will let it happen.
This is an underrated point. France has a rope around its neck that the EU can tighten or loosen at will: the Euro. No country in Europe will be able to have sovereign control over its own policies as long as a foreign entity controls their currency. Especially a country as indebted as France is extremely vulnerable to financial suffocation by the ECB.
Yes, but I think the causal link is a bit more subtle. The ECB can simply signal that it doesn’t consider France financially sound and then sit back instead of acting as lender of last resort while the markets stop refinancing France’s debt. Basically, what happened to Greece.
He already is, some candidates have been meddled with during the last elections.
🤘
Now this is something I can get behind. Vive la France.
I wish it were credible
His phrasing is a pretty clear indication that he’s not going to do anything.
